Devising and Physical Theatre

Episode 110: Devising and Physical Theatre

Pilar Orti talks about how you can devise (create theatre from an idea) using physical theatre. How do you find stimulus for a piece, explore that stimulus physically, and (most importantly) how to fail when you create. “If you don’t fail you don’t discover.”

Show Notes

• devisingandphysicaltheatre.com
• @devisingTheatre #decourse
• daniellehindtsdevising.blogspot.co.uk
• DV8
• Frantic Assembly: A guide to devising (excerpt)

Episode Transcript

Welcome to TFP – The Theatrefolk Podcast – the place to be for Drama teachers, Drama students, and theatre educators everywhere.

I’m Lindsay Price, resident playwright for Theatrefolk.

Hello, I hope you’re well. Thanks for listening.

Welcome to Episode 110! You can find all the links for this episode at theatrefolk.com/episode110.

How are you this week? Are you getting back into the school swing? I’ve been out of school for twenty years, twenty-plus years, and, you know, I still get a little knot in the pit of my stomach come September. You know, that back-to-school worry. How about you? Are you knotted? Maybe you’re in a panic about grades? Or are you one of those types who just eases into the school year nice and slow? Because there’s lots of time to get things right, right? Maybe?

You know, getting something wrong in the classroom, especially the Drama classroom, is a tough thing for students to overcome – that it’s not a bad thing, that getting something wrong is exploratory – because, for them, if you get something wrong, if you fail, that means you get a bad grade. But, to fail in Drama when you’re trying something out, maybe if you’re creating a movement piece or creating a new script or doing an improv, if you mess something up, instead of going, “Uh, that was wrong,” and stopping, it’s an opportunity to explore a different path, right?

And I think, particularly if you’re creating a play in your class, it’s important to celebrate failure and to encourage students to, “Okay, try again.” And this is just one of the things I talk about with Pilar Orti in this week’s podcast about devising theatre. It’s a great talk so I think we should get right to it.

Lindsay: All right. Hello, everybody! I am thrilled today to have a guest on the podcast.

I am speaking to Pilar Orti. Hello, Pilar!

Pilar: Hello, Lindsay!

Lindsay: How are you?

Pilar: Great to meet you.

Lindsay: Yeah, great to meet you, too! Well, and it’s a very special sort of across the pond kind of conversation we’re having here. Tell everybody where you are in the world right now.

Pilar: I’m in London.

Lindsay: Are you from there originally? Where do you come from?

Pilar: Well, I was born in Madrid many years ago, but I came to the UK in 1990 and have been here since then so this is my home now.

Lindsay: Awesome. Okay. So, we’re talking today with Pilar. She has a book out, a second edition of a book called Your Handy Companion to Devising and Physical Theatre, and these are two things which I think can go either way in the high school classroom, can’t they?

Pilar: Yeah.

Lindsay: Yeah

Pilar: Yes, unfortunately.

Lindsay: They can go very, very well or they can go pretty wrong. So, we want to focus on how to make these particular two topics, we want to make them go well.

Pilar: Yes.

Lindsay: Let’s just talk a bit about your background. So, where did your interest in devising theatre come from? Do you have a background in it?

Pilar: I think I blame my mother.

Lindsay: “I blame my mother for devising theatre.”

Pilar: Yes, for the good things in my life.

I grew up in Spain, like I said. My mother used to take me to.very theatrical stuff. Instead of taking me to traditional plays, she would take me to some of the more alternative scene and she enrolled me in mime classes, movement classes, which were always cancelled really quickly because my friend and I were the only ones attending.

So, I grew up seeing stuff on stage that I couldn’t see in real life and I saw people using their bodies in strange ways, using language in ways that I didn’t come across every day. So, I think my interest is more in physical theatre and devising because I didn’t really come across the word “devising” until I came to the U7K. I think it came from what I was being exposed to. And then, when I was eighteen, I came to do a Biology degree, so I’m very interested in the body.

And then, I went to Drama school and I went to Mountview Theatre School in London for three years doing classical actor training and was incredibly lucky to come across really good physical theatre directors and practitioners – some of whom had studied with Lecoq in France – you know, king of devising of physical theatre for this century. And that exposure just reinforced what I already knew – that I liked to do theatrical stuff; that language goes very well with movement; that theatre is about collaboration. For me, you know, you can still do theatre without it being extremely collaborative, but for me, it’s important. And that, as actors also – I trained as an actress – I also want to

have ownership of the piece from the beginning. I think, as an actor, it’s great to come into a good script and, at the end of that creative process, but it’s also really exciting to be there at the beginning and give it shape and decide where you want to go with it. So, that’s my interest.

Then, I set up a theatre company with a friend and then started to see how we taught physical theatre and that’s really where I started to learn what my practice was about when I started teaching others.

Lindsay: Well, I think these two particular things – devising theatre and also physical theatre – I think they have quite the place in a high school classroom. You know, the whole notion of devising.

So, let’s dive into that. What’s your definition of devising theatre? What does it mean to devise a piece?

Pilar: For me, it’s to start a piece from scratch. Well, from scratch as in maybe with a stimulus, so maybe an idea. So, you have an idea and then you create. Creative theatre is what I would call it. So, devising for me is you have an idea or the group has an idea or the group are given an idea and they create a piece. So, they decide where the story is going, the group decides the form which is very important. So, it could be that you devise something that has naturalistic dialogue – you know, that’s still devising. For me, it’s more interesting to put surrealism into it. But that’s, for me, my definition of devising is when a group creates a piece of theatre from an idea.

Lindsay: I know it as a collective creation kind of thing.

Pilar: Yeah.

Lindsay: And it’s just this whole notion, particularly in schools, we’re looking at building skills, right? So, the whole notion of communication between a group of students who have to work on a piece from scratch, the whole notion of working as a team and just working with each other when there is no script to fall back on, when they really have to build a piece, and the pride that comes at the end of something like that I think is pretty phenomenal and I think very impactful at the school level.

Pilar: Yeah, it’s a real learning experience. It means you have really learn to listen, it means that you have to learn how to take the initiative, and that doesn’t just mean that you have lots of ideas but the initiative of, “Look, let’s start working. We have to finish the script by day X and we don’t have a teacher that’s going to tell us. We need to do it. We set our schedule. We meet our deadlines. We make sure we turn up on time and start working. We make sure we make the most out of our time together,” and I think that’s really important.

Lindsay: Well, I think that hits right on one point where devising can go awry and that a schedule is actually very important. Like, it seems that, “Oh, it’s improv,” and there’s an exploring and experimenting stage and a creation stage. But, actually, the schedule of putting the piece together I think is one of the pillars of devising theatre.

Pilar: Yes, because you need that roadmap, and especially because you’re starting probably with very little restrictions, very few restrictions, you need to start guiding yourself and you have to put some limitations for yourself and some milestones or else, like you say, you just start creating.

And one thing that I think is very important is to set time for rehearsing because I think many students, like you were saying, it’s great fun to create and experiment but, “Oh, do we have to go over that again?” and the discipline of repeating stuff and fine-tuning, I think that is very important, especially if they want to go into the performance arts.

Lindsay: So, let’s talk about the stimulus. You talked about how devising theatre usually starts with an idea or a stimulus. In a class, is this something that you think that the teacher should come up with? Or do you think it should just stem from the students?

Pilar: A bit of both.

In a way, I think the teacher has to take responsibility for some stuff, for some of the things when a group of students is creating, and one of them could be setting the stimulus, more than anything, because she knows the students – she or he, of course – they know the students, they know what might interest them, or also what might stretch them.

So, for example, they might know that a film might be a better stimulus than a painting for some. Or a novel. Or a newspaper cutting. Or he or she might throw it at them and say, “Right. Next term or whatever, we’re going to be looking at creating your own piece. Do you want to start coming up with ideas of where the story could go?” I don’t know.

So, it’s a mixture. I think it really depends. But I think the teacher should make the decision of who’s going to give them the stimulus.

Lindsay: It could be something too that, you know, if you’re going to do it in a month or so, or six weeks or so, like, “Okay. For a couple of weeks now, everyone’s responsible for coming in with one painting or one current event or one thing that interests them,” so that there’s a methodology to coming up with ideas. So, when they get to Day 1 of their devising project, instead of throwing it at them and saying, “Okay! Ideas?”

Pilar: Yeah, that’s great, and it also will get them into the state of mind where they’re looking around them to then create this piece. So, to also get to the artist inspired by lots of stuff around us that we don’t even expect is going to influence us. So, that idea of starting to look out, yeah.

Lindsay: Yeah, like when I talk about playwriting, I’m always emphasizing, like, observation. “Look around you. Start gathering. Gather what’s going to inspire you instead of just sort of waiting for amuse to hit and make it a practical application.”

Pilar: Yes.

Lindsay: Three things you talk about in your book that seem to work well as common stimulus are fairy tales, paintings, and current affairs. Are those three things that just seem to commonly hit home?

Pilar: I think that’s the stimulus I’ve seen teachers use. Also, I think, with fairy tales, for example, it means that immediately you have the group on the same page, more or less. Of course, there’s variations, but at least it’s quicker, maybe it needs less research. The painting is something very visual so we all know what we’re looking at and then we can have ideas. And with current themes, I think, sometimes, with students, creating their own work, it’s easier if it’s in the now. If their hook at the beginning is now, it’s a world they understand. So, I think that was my reasoning behind using those three.

Lindsay: I find that what’s going to hook a student more than anything is something that’s in their world, right?

Pilar: Yes.

Lindsay: A current event that’s going on in their world.

I really liked a couple of suggestions you had like, for example, if you have a painting where there’s no people in it, to get students to create a population – you know, like, come up with the character that would live in this painting. Or, for the fairy tale, to create characters who, like, are the minor characters who you don’t actually see in the original fairy tale.

Pilar: Yeah, I think it’s good to remember that these are stimulus and that’s the thing – that it’s something to get you going and then you can move away from them as much as you want or you can.

Lindsay: Okay. That’s a really interesting point to come up because I think that devising really requires students to try things out, to fail, to try again, and that’s hard. That’s hard for students to grasp.

So, how do you circumvent the students who don’t want to fail? What would you tell teachers? How to encourage students to try and try again?

Pilar: That’s a very interesting question because the other thing I do at the moment is I work in organizations with adults.

Lindsay: Who don’t want to fail either?

Pilar: Yes, and actually, nobody wants to fail. It’s difficult to take risks. But, if you don’t fail, you don’t discover. I think, really, you can’t really bring this in just for your devising unit. I think it’s something that has to underpin all practice in your Drama classroom – that every time someone gets it horribly wrong, you laugh with them, you say, “How was that? Yeah? Why was it like that?” You know? But how great because, if you hadn’t stumbled over, we now wouldn’t have a comedy scene!

Or, “Are you having problems with that line? Okay. What might that tell us about the character?” and really make every time that somebody does something that they might think of as wrong, show that it’s part of growing – it’s how you deal with that – and, also, that there are things that we might learn when we get things wrong. And then, that means that, by the time they come to devise, they’re used to making mistakes and also not to take yourself too seriously.

Lindsay: You know, I kind of like that as a bit of side coaching for teachers to kind of just say, when a mistake happens, say, “That was great!” To really switch that around and when, oh, they’re just so afraid of being wrong, isn’t it? It’s hard.

Pilar: There’s a game I came across. I didn’t make it up myself. You throw a ball and every time the ball drops – you’re throwing it in a circle and you’re trying to make nice patterns or whatever but every time someone drops the ball, everyone goes, “Hurrah!” and that’s the beginning of celebrating getting something wrong.

Also, getting things wrong when you’re devising, it just means you open up other possibilities. So, it’s also about thinking in a different way about what it means to get something wrong. You know, turning up late is getting it wrong.

Lindsay: Yes, right! Not following the schedule is getting it wrong.

Pilar: Exactly.

Lindsay: Fascinating. Okay.

So, for a devise piece, you sort of put together a couple of stages. So, it seems that things out with research. When you’re telling a teacher or a class to research a stimulus, what kind of things are they looking for?

Pilar: Well, it depends what they’re doing.

If they’re setting it in a specific time, then they would research that time. If they are setting it now, for example, then once you have an idea for a character, you can look into their world. So, if they have a profession that you’ve never heard of, you will look

into that.

You can also research visually. So, you can look for images and, again, when we’re devising, we also need to think about what the show is going to look like so we might want to look at what colors inspire us.

So, it’s about looking into what can you bring into the rehearsal room that will feed the process, and it could be something quite random. You could just say, “You know what? I was looking at this painting,” or, “I came across this story or this photograph. I’m not sure, I just wanted to bring it into the rehearsal. Let’s see what we can do with it.”

And there’s also the academic part of that. If you’re following a curriculum, you will need to support what you’re doing with theatre theory or drama theory.

So, for example, if you’re looking at physical theatre, you might want to research into Lecoq and to companies in your city or your country that are doing a similar style. If you have a painting as a stimulus, you’ll want to research that painter, et cetera. So, it’s about understanding pretty much what context you’re working in, just like if you were studying a playwright.

Lindsay: Yeah, excellent.

Pilar: What’s influencing you.

Lindsay: Good. Excellent.

And then, we move on to the experimentation stage. How long would you suggest that students experiment with their stimulus?

Pilar: I think about 50 percent, yeah.

Lindsay: Okay.

Pilar: If we say that about – I don’t know – 10 or 15 percent at the beginning is just getting used to working together and knowing what is this that we’re doing, then 50 percent of experimenting, creating material, because experimenting is about creating your own character as well – trying things out, seeing what works, what doesn’t. And then, the last quarter or so, a bit more, then you start to nail down, “Okay. This is what we’re doing.” But that experimentation phase is about you understanding your own process, also about you understanding how you’re collaborating with others, and really understanding the world of the play.

Lindsay: What are some activities that would be good for experimentation? Would they use a lot of improv?

Pilar: Yes, again, it depends because, if you have somebody who is quite a good writer, you can have people improvising a scene where they’re talking and somebody writes down what they’re saying, or it could be improvisations around the world of the character. So, for example, if we have a couple – say we have a couple in this piece – and they are about to break up, we could have improvisations around how they met. So, we’re using that experimentation to improvise the world that the audience might never see and I think that’s very difficult for the students to understand.

Lindsay: Usually, I find that too with student playwrights, they get very focused on the world of the play that happens from word one to word last and yet that experimentation of what’s going on with characters outside the world of the play can be very informative.

Pilar: Yeah, and the thing is – sorry on that, Lindsay – that you can have very strong ideas in your head of how your character is, but until you improvise or are just in the space with another of your friends playing and improvising, you’re not going to really discover anything beyond your own experience also.

Lindsay: So then, what happens in the creation stage? Do things become a bit more formal? We’re talking about the creation of the actual piece.

Pilar: I think that’s about giving it structure. The piece, in the end, needs to have structure. So, we need to see, “Okay. How are we going to start this piece? What order are the scenes going to follow? Are we going to have short scenes? Long scenes?” and really nailing down the script in whatever way that comes out. So, it could be, if it’s a movement piece, we need to know what’s happening, more or less, in each scene.

Lindsay: It’s not necessarily a particular written script which we’ll talk about in a second with physical theatre. It could just be “Here’s the description of scene one. Here’s the description of scene two.” It’s all about the schedule, isn’t it? And the structure.

Pilar: Yeah, and when you don’t have dialogue, you have to remember that you might still have technical support. So, somebody might need to follow some sort of script.

Lindsay: Yeah, if you’ve got a guy who’s doing your sound, if you just are like, “Oh, we might be doing this and we might be doing this,” that’s of no help to them.

Pilar: Yeah.

Lindsay: And there’s always an audience. If you’re going to put this in front of an audience, you can’t have a mish mash. It’s got to follow a procedure.

Pilar: Exactly. So, I suppose, from that point of view, what you’re saying, “The creation piece is okay. Now, we’ve got to present it to an audience. How are going to communicate everything we’ve been working on? What’s the best way?”

Lindsay: And then, lastly, you talked a bit about how the rehearsal process is that you’re just sort of going over and over again. How do you stop students from getting into a rote where they sort of nail down one way of doing things and then they never vary?

Pilar: It’s very important to get them trained in a way to observe each other and to observe other groups because I think that, by seeing how different groups or different people are working on their own pieces, you can have “a-ha!” moments of, “Oh, they’re doing this! Isn’t that interesting? Oh, okay. Oh, we’re not doing this. Oh, could we do that differently?” and also get input from other students.

And then, also, just don’t be afraid. I think the teacher – although they have to be hands-off – you can still come in and look at something and make suggestions. “That is very heavily scripted. Do you think you could come up with a thirty-second movement sequence that would sum that up? Wouldn’t that be more exciting?” So, yeah, I think you can come in and make specific suggestions.

You can also give them exercises that will unlock them. So, for example, I think it’s something I suggest in the book is that people swap characters.

Lindsay: Oh! What a great idea!

Pilar: Yes. So, swap characters. When you have something like a script, give them to someone else to do your scene and watch and see what they do with the material and that might unlock something different. Or go away and do it really fast – this is something we used to do in rehearsal. Do the piece really, really fast or do the piece without words or put extra words or do it as if you were Shakespeare, et cetera. So, just really play with it and that might just go, “Crrrk!” and shift something to then carry on the other side.

Lindsay: You also have an exercise on your log for the book. It was the old women exercise. So, you imagine two old crones and, if they were talking about your show – so not your actors or not you as actors or not you as the act of it, but – what would they say about your show? So that you are honing in on knowing exactly what the show is presenting and maybe what you want for the show. When students get awry that they don’t exactly clearly know what they want to communicate.

Pilar: Yeah, it’s very difficult.

Lindsay: Absolutely. Absolutely.

Okay. So, one of the things that happens in devising theatre – as I’m sure you know but for our listening audience – is that, once you have the stimulus, you also want to decide on a style and about what kind of style. It could be a musical theatre style, it could be a realism style, it could be in the style of a particular practitioner like Brecht, or it could be in the style of physical theatre.

So, what to you is your definition of physical theatre?

Pilar: To me, it’s where text and physical expression have equal weight or where physical expression has more weight than text.

When I used to the run the theatre company, there was always this spectrum of physical theatre which is from doing Shakespeare but stylizing it heavily using chorus, et cetera, to right to dance theatre which is right at the other spectrum.

But, for me, it’s when what the actor is doing physically is as important as or more important than what they’re doing vocally.

Lindsay: I think that’s one of the hardest things to instil in a student performer – the physical body – because a lot of them, they have so much issue with their body in life that, you know, things are changing, things are growing, they’re becoming themselves. All they want is to be as inside themselves as possible.

Pilar: Yes. Plus, you don’t get that much stimulus to this kind of theatre also because there’s a lot of television, there’s a lot of film, and there’s sometimes access to musicals. But there is not that much exposure to this kind of theatre so it’s difficult to imagine sometimes.

Lindsay: How to do it, you know?

Pilar: Yes.

Lindsay: You’ve got a quote – I believe I heard this on your site, but I think it’s in your book too – from Christian Darley which was that imagination is in the body and I just think that’s the best image when we’re talking about how do we physicalize, instead of using imagination with words, to use the physical to be imaginative.

Pilar: Yeah. And that, again, is something that we can lay down the foundations during all the Drama lessons to really be aware of space – the fact that we have space behind us and to our sides – not just in front of us. The space above us and how we relate to this space makes us look different and feel different. We can move in different ways. We can move across but also to the sides and down and up, and getting used to that – the fact that just moving differently gives something different to an audience.

Lindsay: One thing you say is that, in physical theatre, you’re using the body in ways it isn’t in real life and that is a concept that I think is hard for them to grasp. But, oh, if they could, right? How do you get them to use their body in ways it isn’t used in real life? Well, that’s another podcast for an hour!

Pilar: Yes! It’s difficult sometimes because sometimes I used to come across, especially teenagers who will say, “Yeah, this is all very well, but when are we doing proper acting?”

Lindsay: Yeah.

Pilar: If they can have exposure to Jacques Tati or Charles Chaplin or something. So, you can take them to a place where you know this is a style. I’m not saying that this is the only way of doing theatre, but look, by doing this, you can have comedy, you can have sadness, and you can transport your audience wherever you want.

If you want to set a place in the moon, but you can’t change the way you move, how are the audience going to believe that? Or, if you want to set a play – I don’t know – for example, in rural Spain in the 1930s – like a lot of Lorca is done, you have to change how you move because a person moving in the middle of the countryside in 40 degrees heat is not going to move the same as you in your Drama studio.

I think it’s getting them to observe also. Look at how people move outside. Watch different films set in different countries. You know, people move differently so you need to learn to move differently so the audience can believe you, really.

Lindsay: Do you use video a lot with students? Do you think that’s a good practice to get them to sort of understand what physical theatre is?

Pilar: I didn’t use to because, being in London, it was quite easy to – well, usually, the groups would – watch some of this theatre and I used to teach in a sixth form and we’d bring my own theatre company in.

Lindsay: You’ve had access to yourself.

Pilar: Yes, I had access to myself.

Lindsay: Okay. So, what about those teachers in the middle of nowhere who doesn’t have access to it?

Pilar: I think videos are really good. I think something like DV8 videos or any experimental theatre videos you can get on YouTube, anything to show, “Look, we’re not just doing this in the classroom. There are people out there who are professional actors who work in this way.” If you can have access to any Frantic Assembly videos, they’re a British company of theatre; the Complicite – again, I only know the British companies.

So, it’s about giving the art form the respect it deserves by saying it’s not just something we do in the classroom. It’s done outside. It’s proper theatre.

Lindsay: How important are warm-ups when you’re working in physical theatre?

Pilar: For me, they’re important for every kind of theatre!

Lindsay: Ah, well, that’s true, too.

Pilar: Warm-ups have lots of different functions and the most obvious ones are getting the body ready. Usually, in everyday life, like I said, maybe we don’t move our fingers much or we don’t move our elbows a lot. So, if you’re going to get ready to work in a physical way, you have to remember you’ve got these appendages and that you can move them. So, that’s the very practical.

Again, we’re doing something that we don’t really want to succeed at. We’re just warming up because we need to do it and we do it together and we look silly while we’re doing it because a lot of warm-ups don’t make us look very glamorous. So, we get used to that. We get used to being silly and we get used to coming together to do something together and we practice things like failure. If we do games, we practice getting it wrong and then it just eases into the practice.

Lindsay: It’s sort of a training ground for everything that you need in all theatre where, when things go wrong, it’s a good thing.

Pilar: Games are really powerful and they’re still seen just as the little thing you do at the beginning of a rehearsal or the class. But I think you could teach theatre through games and then leave the proper acting till later because they teach you a lot.

Lindsay: If you’re using warm-ups to sort of get everybody used to the notion of working together, the ensemble in physical theatre is really important, isn’t it?

Pilar: Yes, for me, it’s key. Again, it’s a matter of taste and opinion. But what I really like about devising is that it really is a piece that the group has created and, when people watch it, they go, “Wow! They’re working so well together.” Again, that’s beautiful to see because you don’t see it every day!

Lindsay: I think that’s another issue, too. Students sometimes hear the word “ensemble” and they’re used to a musical theatre world where ensemble means lesser and it’s like, “No, the ensemble is the full cast. It’s everybody all together.”

Pilar: Yeah, it’s everyone and making sure that everyone knows that every time they are on-stage or watching a rehearsal, they need to be contributing in some way.

Lindsay: Yeah, and that’s my favorite use of the word – that every theatre company is an ensemble and that everybody needs to work together.

Okay. So, as we wrap up here, when we’re doing physical theatre in a classroom, what are three key points that teachers need to make sure is happening with their students? What are three key points to make physical theatre really come to life?

Pilar: One is something that actually applies to all Drama and it’s make sure that people are looking at each other.

Lindsay: Ah, looking and listening, right?

Pilar: Yes, that people are making eye contact, that they’re giving space to other people. That’s very important. That underpins all theatre where it’s not a monologue.

The other thing is that space is being used in different ways and that we change our relationship with space. Every time we show our work to the rest of the class, we are always there on that bit of wall and we all sit here with our chairs. Change that.

Lindsay: I love that.

Pilar: Yeah, because then it gets the students thinking about space because part of devising and physical theatre is also thinking about where am I going to perform this and how. So, those are two.

And, the third one is, just as soon as people are not laughing or enjoying themselves and getting all passionate, then there’s a problem. So, watch out for low emotions. I think high emotions are great – even if at some point they are angered, it doesn’t matter. But, if people are coasting along, something’s wrong.

Lindsay: Awesome.

Okay. So, Pilar’s book is Your Handy Companion to Devising and Physical Theatre. I have read this book. I really enjoy it and I really think that students and teachers will enjoy it because, first of all, it is not – and I say this with love – it’s not fancy pants. I don’t want to read theory. I want practical and I want exercises and, when I read this book, I’m like, “I want to go devise theatre. I want to go do physical theatre,” and I think that that’s really important for particularly high school teachers. We’re not talking about pedagogy. We’re talking about stuff you can do in the Drama classroom.

I’m going to put Pilar’s website – devisingandphysicaltheatre.com – in our show notes and I think you should all go to her Twitter @DevisingTheatre – #decourse. There’s a whole bunch of Twitter tips that Pilar’s got for devising theatre which I think is awesome.

Also, one more thing that I got from her website, you talk about how important it is to journal the process and you have an online journal there and I’m going to murder her name horribly but Danielle Hind.

Pilar: Yes.

Lindsay: And she has a whole blog about her process. Now, was she working with students? They looked quite young.

Pilar: No, I think she’s a student herself. I just came across her in the website.

Lindsay: Fabulous!

Pilar: Yeah, absolutely fantastic.

Lindsay: And I think that there are some videos on daniellehindtsdevising.blogspot.co.uk that really eliminate what you’re talking about in terms of physical theatre. There’s an inner outer character exercise that just shows what you’re talking about, how it can work, and how it can just take students in a whole new direction.

Pilar: Excellent.

Lindsay: Thank you so much, Pilar! I really enjoyed this discussion and I think that our listeners are going to enjoy, too.

Pilar: Well, I hope so. Thank you very much, Lindsay! And thanks for reading the book, too.

Thank you, Pilar!

So, the links for this episode can be found at theatrefolk.com/episode110.

So, before we go, let’s do some THEATREFOLK NEWS!

Our latest catalogue is now out in the world – completely up-to-date with all our new plays, all our educational resources, all the information you need about getting a play, getting rights, getting it all done.

You can get an electronic copy of our catalogue on our website – that’s www.theatrefolk.com – or you can also request a hard copy there as well and we will send you your very own printed copy in the mail and everything.

Finally, where, oh, where can you find this podcast? We post new episodes every Wednesday at theatrefolk.com and on our Facebook page and Twitter. You can find us on YouTube.com/Theatrefolk, and you can find us on the Stitcher app. You can also subscribe to TFP on iTunes. All you have to do is search on the word “Theatrefolk.”

And that’s where we’re going to end. Take care, my friends. Take care.

Music credit:”Ave” by Alex (feat. Morusque) is licensed under a Creative Commons license.